2001 Alero no start wait a minuet and starts

ford_offroader

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Hey new to this. in the shop is a 2001 alero 88k that will not start. This is the problem. You get in the car and go to start it and it will not start just cranks over, wait 30 sec. and it starts. dealer has replaced the ign module , crk sensor , ign cylinder and pass lock, fuel pump and fuel filter. with no change to the starting of the car. No security light on , no codes , Just looking for some different points of view on this. Dealer has given up on the car. Thanks
 

C&C

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Just a WAG (wild ass guess); leaky fuel injector flooding the cylinder(s) after shutting down; clears after the first cranking try.
 

ford_offroader

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Thanks for the idea. I will look in to it . I'm leaning to ecm or bcm problems. But that gets expensive WAG for something that only takes you siting for a couple seconds and starts. Going to hook my snap-on scanner to in next week and see what i can find. The dealer in town gave up on it and now its at my shop.
 

Cutlass350

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Fwiw, your mechanic doesn't know anything about older GM vehicles.
If it was done at a dealership, it sounds like they put some idiot newbie on your car.
I guess that idiot newbie is great at playing Angry Birds on his cell phone, but doesn't have the slightest clue on how to use GM's problem search function.
Then again, maybe GM deleted the data base for the older cars?
GM does many foolish things.


Replace the fuel pressure regulator. It's a very well known problem.
Do a search on this forum for more info.

Any dealership mechanic should've changed the fuel pressure regulator with your car's symptoms. GM maintains a database of problems and solutions.
The fuel pressure regulators are know to develop leaks in the rubber diaphragm. For most of the regulators, the parts are not very expensive, not hard to replace, nor time intensive to replace.
The regulators wear out with age and use. So, it's common to replace the regulators if someone has a cold start problem.

Fwiw, if you let the car sit for ~week, it would likely start just fine on the first crank - assuming the rest of the engine/controls/sensors are fine.



Good Luck!
 

ford_offroader

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Thanks everyone I will replace it this week and let everyone know how it works. This is not the 1st time the dealer in town could not find the problem. But like you said its older and a lot of the young techs only know the computers and if it does not pop a code they are lost.
 

Cutlass350

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To get a better handle on things, you need to check the fuel pressure at these times.

A) With the car running.

B) Right after you turn off the car.

C) 5 mins after you turn off the car.

D) After 8+ hours after you turn off the car.


Note: If you do those tests in a row, start the car, let it run for 20 secs, then turn it off between tests.

Also, put paper towels around the pressure test port, to keep the gas from spilling and making a big mess.


Good Luck!
 

ford_offroader

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Thanks . Going to do a injector balance test as well to see if there is a problem with and single one of them.
 

ford_offroader

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This is what i got so far
running - 44psi
after shut off - 38psi
after 5 min of being off - 32psi
3 hours after shut off - 2psi
 

Cutlass350

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This is what i got so far
running - 44psi
after shut off - 38psi
after 5 min of being off - 32psi
3 hours after shut off - 2psi
The most likely cause of that is from a bad fuel pressure regulator.
But, it could also be caused by:
a bad fuel pump
one or more bad injectors


C&C may be the winner at guess the cause. :)

First, try the following:
When starting the engine:
1) Turn key to "on", but not crank.
2) Leave it there for ~3 seconds. The pump cuts off if there's no rpm.
3) Turn the key to "off".
4) Wait 3 seconds

5) Turn key to "on", but not crank.
6) Leave it there for ~3 seconds. The pump cuts off if there's no rpm.
7) Turn the key to "off".
8) Wait 3 seconds

9) Try to start the engine normally.
By this time, the fuel pressure would be primed. It might be primed after the first try. But, it might not.

If that works, as I suspect it will, that confirms that the issue is the loss of fuel pressure.

Since the fuel pump and fuel pressure regulator have been replaced, and I'm assuming you don't see any fuel leaking on the ground, I'd suggest try replacing the injectors.

Or, you can live with doing the "prime the fuel pressure" dance.

Good Luck!
 

ford_offroader

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The injector balance test came out to the same on every injector. Scan tool primes the system to 50 psi and when you buzz each injector they all come out to 31 Psi. This is frustrating ! ! Maybe i got a bad FPR ? I have been having a lot of trouble with BWD parts went throw 6 oil sender units on a LB7 motor last week before i got a good one and got a bad multi-function switch as well from BWD.
 

Cutlass350

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The injector balance test came out to the same on every injector. Scan tool primes the system to 50 psi and when you buzz each injector they all come out to 31 Psi. This is frustrating ! ! Maybe i got a bad FPR ? I have been having a lot of trouble with BWD parts went throw 6 oil sender units on a LB7 motor last week before i got a good one and got a bad multi-function switch as well from BWD.
In general, I say buy and use on GM OEM parts!
Yes, there is PLENTY of pure cr*p out there.
What's even worse, is that the counterfeit market for automotive markets is MASSIVE! I posted on here before, about fake hub parts being confiscated in Canada.

With my Achieva, I went through 4++ Crank Position Sensors before I bought one directly from the dealer. The other ones would fail in a few months.

Also with my Achieva, I bought (likely) counterfeit hubs from ebay. One lasted ~4months before it started making noise.
Again, I then bought hubs directly from the dealer.

The dealer bought CPS and hubs are now over 10 years old. No problems with either.

NOTE: Delphi/Delco is now outsourcing some replacement parts. So, you get cr*p!
I just had that problem with a Delphi fuel pump bought from Amazon (not a reseller).
The ^&*^*(* POS fuel pump assembly leaked from the tank pressure sensor on the top of the assembly. Even if Delphi doesn't make that sensor themselves, it still caused a leak on their POS fuel pump assembly.

Yup, sometimes you just can't win. :)
 

ford_offroader

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Thanks for all the help. Just going to run it this way for now tell it becomes more of a problem. OEM parts are the way to go and sometimes the oem part is cheaper then the after market. Run in to that a lot with oem ford parts.
 
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